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Anonymous 05/13/2022 (Fri) 16:46:12 No.11016
Your ESV, KJV, NIV, WHATEVERV Bibles are wrong and apostate heresy. "Scripture is licherally God breathed! My particular translation is licherally inspired!" *proceeds to translate the Old Testament from Apostate Jewish manuscripts of the 11th century* EVERY translation uses the Leningrad and Aleppo Hebrew manuscripts (Masoretic text) from the 11th and 10th century. When we know for a fact they are corrupted Jewish manuscripts. As far back as the 2nd century Christians were talking about Jews manipulating scriptures to attack Christians such as Isaiah 7:14, not that they could get away with much but the idea these Godless apostates jealous that God was reaching the gentiles actually cared spiritually about their scriptures is ridiculous. "But the Dead Sea scrolls are pretty close to the Masoreric text right?" Yeah, close. You know what's closer is the Greek Septuagint manuscripts that we have from the 4th century. It wasn't just the Jews of the New Testament, everyone around the 1st century used the Greek Bible. I'm not going to go into every example but let's look the age of the Earth. Septuagint calculates 5554 BC, Masoretic calculates 4004 BC. Who is right? Well again everyone around the 1st century calculating the age came often closer to 5500 BC than 4000 BC. And most importantly the Dead Sea scrolls agree with the Septuagint! So for all my fellow Bible believers, our Earth began in 5554 BC. Let us use the Bible which Jesus and all the saints quoted from until we decided the synagogue of Satan should write our scriptures. "O great one, I kneelth to the truth, what say ye where for the translation we cometh hitherto?" Yea nave, there are no realistic options for a true Old Testament English Bible... and that's the end of the story. Helpful links https://www.bible.ca/manuscripts/Bible-chronology-charts-age-of-earth-date-Genesis-5-11-Septuagint-text-LXX-original-autograph-corrupted-Masoretic-MT-primeval-5554BC.htm http://ecclesia.org/truth/septuagint.html https://thetencommandmentsministry.us/ministry/charles_thomson/ https://digitalcommons.cedarville.edu/icc_proceedings/vol5/iss1/27/ There's two main English translations of the Septuagint manuscripts with the correct geaneologies. Brenton's and Charles Thompson's. The Orthodox Study Bible going around uses Brenton's translation. https://www.biblehub.com/genesis/5-21.htm 165 not 65. I'm sick of hearing 6,000 year Earth. 7,500 Please. Okay? Alright then.
We should also remove chapter and verse divisions since they were created long after any Bible scripture I know it's crazy Paul didn't verse and chapter his letters. Just say: So and so said this "" or the book of so and so says "" the way the early church did it. Of course I get a feeling God isn't upset that verse numbers were added to the Bible. Everyone hears God's words though their Bible. And for those that aren't sure about the New Testament. That's a separate battle: http://ecclesia.org/truth/m-m.html http://ecclesia.org/truth/manuscript_evidence.html I am surprised the big names like Kent Hovind and AnswerInGenesis haven't moved to a 5554 BC date, things match up better that way. We live in a world where sometimes the obvious truth is just this thing everyone kind of misses.
Sorry, I thought you were right, but then reconsidered the position. There is nothing wrong with the masoretic text. Althought I prefer the septuagint. https://kabane52.tumblr.com/post/635753551958884352/why-the-hebrew-masoretic-manuscript-tradition
>>11016 >I'm sick of hearing 6,000 year Earth. 7,500 Please. Okay? Alright then. that implies that we're already living in the 1,000 year kingdom. Dunno about you but i dont feel like Christ has returned yet.
Over figuring this out I came across some universalists and others. And I know some use this board. "Actually," they say tightening their togas and adjusting their framed painting of Socrates, "the laymen term 'hell' as you common folk call it is simply Gehenna, a valley at Jerusalem. Our God does not torture people with fire in some barbaric prison house or lake of fire oh how you've been fooled by the Catholic Church darling." Yes Gehenna is the valley where they burned babies or idols or garbage or Judas depending on the century. But the New Testament is referencing what we think of as "Hell" as well. I implore these people to go through translations and do a word search of every verse using the terms: Sheol, Gehenna, Hell, The Pit, Lake of Fire, Hades, Tartarus. And then still tell me there isn't a place of pain for unrepentive sinners. The Lake of Fire was prepared for the devil and his angels, it is a place people will be sent to in the end of our world. I do agree based on scripture "Hell" nor the Lake of Fire are guaranteed to be eternal and without escape for humans. But they exist.
>>11023 Well I think there is plenty wrong with them. They are clearly different, 1% different yes but different than what the 1st century church used and what the Dead Sea scrolls say.
>>11026 "Hell" exists but its not eternal in way most people think. its a fire that consumes and destroys the soul eternally. its a quick and easy way for God to get rid of people who didnt believe in Him. People implying that its some kind of torture are making a huge contradiction. First we must understand that God is a balance of positive yet conflicting virtues (for example Mercy and Justice, you cannot have a pure form of Mercy and a pure form of Justice at the same time therefore they must be balanced). This concept of balance applies to Humanity and Hell. You see the problem with traditional understanding of Hell is that it makes no sense when viewed in the grand scheme of things. The story goes that God loves humanity so He creates humans knowing that not all of them will love Him back and then He decides to brutally torture them in hell forever? that makes no sense. So now lets view it from the perspective of "Balance Theory". God creates all humans (even sinners) because He loves them and wants them to enjoy life but God also knows that not all humans will love Him back so He kills their souls off quickly via the "eternal fire" of hell. This creates a perfect balance of Love and Justice and helps to explain reality. God Loves the sinners but also enacts Justice over the sinners who reject Him at the same time hopefully i did a decent job of explaining this and didnt sound too schizophrenic .
Of course you can read early Christian writings, take notes of how many times there's a translation note telling you they are quoting the Septuagint. https://ccel.org/ccel/schaff/anf01.html Acts 7:14 quotes the Septuagint version of Genesis 46:27. There's a lot of 'this verse was using the Septuagint' and such. There is no "Septuagint manuscript" certainly none from the 1st century but I find the Greek manuscripts we have from the 4th century are more inline with the New Testament, of course they're both Greek but even the Dead Sea Scrolls. I see little reason to have faith in the Masoretic texts. Yes the Septuagint is a translation of Hebrew and isn't it better to use the original Hebrew and surely probably at least 98% of the Masoretic Text is correctly preserved letter by letter. But in the debate of the Genealoges for example I am going to trust what where the evidence follows.
>>11029 Yes annihilation doctrine and that's possible too. Jesus says God can destroy Souls. The term everlasting punishment is used by Jesus but whenever something is forever or everlasting that pretty much always means conditional everlasting. God said lots of things of the Old Covenant would last forever... so long as Israel kept the covenant which they didn't. I don't know what the lake of fire is all about but the possibility people will perish or can repent and be saved is possible. It could be souls vanish or it could be souls get taught a lesson until they repent or they just stay there forever. Why does God create people he knows will be unsaved actually makes me want to bring up another thing I have seen on the disgusting rise, Satanic Calvinism.
>>11031 i always look to the symbolism of fire. if you throw piece of paper into a fire it doesnt sit there forever, it burns up. So thats one reason i think hell isnt forever. and the words "everlasting" and "eternal" can also just mean forever. The forever death, the forever punishment, the forever fire.
And because I know most people won't look at the links i will post the two possible timelines hopefully accurate this person made. I think a problem with the flood indeed has been that it was later than one would think. It becomes easier to have all the ethnicities and migration and Egypt and China with an extra 800 years. Also means much much less humans buried by the flood. "But how did the kangaroos get from the ark to Australia, time no solve that! Waaah." Well. I've actually come across a number of times when the dates seemed too short so I need to retrace those problems and see for myself. Personally this is all I care about I know the Septuagint and Masoretic disagree on a few other words but this is the real deal that bothers me.
>>11034 >"But how did the kangaroos get from the ark to Australia, time no solve that! Waaah." continental drift
The breaking of the continents happened during the flood. Either moving or literally sinking down and up, that's also how you get many mountains and massive bent and twisted sediment layers in mountains which are ridiculous from the evolutionary perspective. It happened quickly, over a year. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eOcndUvedGc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zd5-dHxOQhg There was an ice age after the flood and the ocean levels were much lower in the past as everyone agrees, isolated animals could get there across land bridges and get stuck once the sea levels rise. You also have humans bringing animals across the world that has always happened through history. Animals themselves can migrate great distances. God could have literally moved the animals as well. All that could explain sloths reaching South America but it is the only real challenge I think everything else about the flood is written literally in stone and every little thing explained.
>>11036 yeah
>>11030 Masoreticists accuse the Septuagint of being manipulated to fit the quotations of the gospels. That's what I saw commented by them in an article about the Septuagint. I think they also view the Greeks as inferior to the Hebrews.
>>11050 the Hebrew version seems to fit the gospel pretty well imo
>>11050 The Greek New Testament matches the Greek Old Testament and it matches the Hebrew Dead Sea scrolls. The masoretic text matches nobody. That's the situation. The Greek Bible was faithfully translated from the Hebrew Bible. Hebrew was dead by time the masoretic text tradition became a thing. Any conflicts the favour should go to the Septuagint and Dead Sea Scrolls not the masoretic, and translators do that, sometimes. Jews will point out the New Testament has errors when in reference to the Hebrew Bible, which is true. Because no one in the first century used the Hebrew Bible from a 1000 years in the future, they used the Bibles they had in the 1st century. We say "they were referencing the Septuagint tradition" They could have just been referencing the original Hebrew Bible we wouldn't know.
The Dead Sea scrolls are mostly from the 3rd century, the same century the Septuagint was written. So it makes sense they match. I can't think of a single reason to trust the 11th century Hebrew Bible when it comes to minor mistakes like life span numbers. Maybe the oldest manuscripts we have are wrong and the later ones right, maybe. Doubtful. Earth is 7500 years old. Eat it 6000ers.
>>11054 >Earth is 7500 years old. Eat it 6000ers. so we are living in 1,000 year kingdom? That makes no sense. my guess is that both are wrong and that we are actually living in the 6,900's , that would make it so that soon we will transition into the 1,000 year kingdom which matches the current events
And of course you can look up comparisons yourself between: Septuagint Masoretic Dead Sea Scrolls Of course even within the traditions themselves there is conflicts among manuscripts, you start thinking the Bible is a mess even though this is all over usually far less than 0.1% of the words. The issue is not clear as nothing ever is with manuscript nonsense but how it is. Even some of the Geaneologies aren't fully in the Dead Sea Scrolls, you have to download the paper I linked to know all about that. >>11055 No. The Earth is 7,500 years old and we are not living in the millennial reign. Have a nice day. Lemonhead. And while we're destroying preconceived notions, Catholic hill and skull rock hill are both wrong: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wV3JHJiXm-4
>>11056 >prideful Catholics and Magisterial Protestants get things wrong but insist on being right because it brings them business Many such cases

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